Episode Transcript
[00:00:02] Speaker A: You're listening to the Zipline Logistics Truck. Yeah. Podcast where we explore all kinds of hot topics in the logistics industry.
Get ready to learn, laugh and get your braid on.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another edition of the Zipline Logistics Podcast. My name is Jesse Jewitt. Join with me as always, our director of training and development, Teddy Lenox. Teddy, good morning. Hello.
[00:00:35] Speaker B: How are you?
[00:00:35] Speaker A: Wonderful, wonderful. We got a special episode today. We have joining us Chris Jolly, the host of Coffee with the Freight Coach podcast and founder of Freight Coach Enterprises. Good morning, Chris.
[00:00:50] Speaker C: Good morning you guys. Thank you so much for having me, Jesse and Teddy.
[00:00:53] Speaker A: Absolutely. Thanks for joining us.
[00:00:54] Speaker B: Thanks for being here.
[00:00:55] Speaker A: Just to clarify here, the Freight Coach Enterprises, or fce, is a third party logistics broker with the mission to niche specific transportation training methods to fit your company culture and vision for the future. Did I get it right, Chris?
[00:01:10] Speaker C: I mean, that pretty much sums it up at this point. It started off, you know, we as doing sales training and then it's kind of like morphed into just doing the media status stuff. And you know, my, my brokerage is actually Freight Coach Logistics, but yeah, it, it is all up in the exact same umbrella there.
[00:01:28] Speaker A: That's awesome. How long have you been in in freight?
[00:01:30] Speaker C: Indirectly, my entire life. I come from a family of truck drivers and then I personally worked as a broker for about 15 years now.
[00:01:39] Speaker A: Okay, so you got some, got some experiences and what led the, what triggered the reason to start the Freight Coach Enterprises?
[00:01:46] Speaker C: Actually it was at the beginning of 2020. I had just moved down to Arizona with my wife and my son and it was March of 2020 and I had resigned from my job as a broker and I was going to go learn the asset side because I was, I felt like I had accomplished everything that I wanted. And I had a bunch of interviews lined up and then that thing called Covid happened. Yeah, like literally all my interviews went away. So I'm like just moved to Arizona. I'm out of a job. It's the beginning of a pandemic. What am I going to do?
And I took, you know, the natural progression of, took a couple of days and drank my face talk and just like it's actually going to happen here. And then I just got on social media and started creating content. Right. Like I was listening to a lot of Gary Vee at the time. Who would recommend, I think everybody should listen to Gary Vee if you want to create content.
And I was doing that for a little bit and then I had put some p. Some content out there about Doing, you know, open deck and heavy haul freight, because that's primarily what I do. Okay. And I had a really large company reach out to me at the time. They're like, hey, can you talk to one of our sales reps? Because, like, we want to offer this, but nobody in our company's ever done it. And then I was initially like, awesome, maybe they'll just hire me to do this. Right? Like, maybe they're going to say, like, this guy's just like, bring me on. And fortunately, though, that didn't happen. And then that's when the light bulb went off in my head at that time, like, well, dang, if these guys need help with sales and ops training, who else does? So that's when I initially filed my LLC and I started doing sales training for freight brokerages and trucking companies out
[00:03:21] Speaker A: there, all in Arizona. Or did you travel at all? I guess you could do Zoom calls and things like that, right?
[00:03:26] Speaker C: Yeah, it was all Zoom.
[00:03:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:29] Speaker C: And I did that, and then I did a couple of site visits, but the majority of my customers were like, hey, let's just have you work on Zoom. And when I say the majority of my customers, that was a couple of years in the making of doing it. Like, I didn't make any money when I first started.
[00:03:42] Speaker A: Right.
[00:03:43] Speaker C: But, you know, after a while, yeah, it was all done via Zoom. And it was not like I was ever working with anybody to teach them what is freight brokerage, but it was more of, like, bringing in a different perspective on how people were doing things. And then it also helped that I wasn't kind of bound to their HR department. So I could just keep it real with people, like, stop saying that, you know, and I didn't have to. And I could actually give an unfiltered opinion on. On how to kind of approach things differently. So it was like I was kind of like a VP of sales by hire. Right. And I could go in there and work with people, help them build up their training in a program for their sales people, their ops team as well. Because I had. I've done both. Right. Like, I was. I was a carrier rep for half of my career, and then I was a sales rep for half of my career. So I had a pretty unique perspective on that.
[00:04:32] Speaker A: Yeah. Varied both sides of the business. That's pretty cool. Certainly makes you see things in a different light, going from one to the other. Would you agree with that?
[00:04:41] Speaker C: No, absolutely. And that's. That's exactly how I think the best sales reps come from operations. Because it's so easy as a sales rep to just get in there and just say yes to everything. Because when you get told no 99 of the time, that first yes is the greatest thing ever. Right. And then after you start to dissect it a little bit, you're just like, oh crap, hold on, that's, that's illegal. I can't actually do that in 24 hours. Like I need two days transit and
[00:05:07] Speaker A: everything else until it's a multi stop load out of. Yeah, North Dakota.
[00:05:12] Speaker B: Well, I think you just made Jesse fall in love. That comment alone.
[00:05:16] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:05:17] Speaker B: Something we love to hear.
[00:05:18] Speaker A: Best sales reps comes from ops. That's where I started. That's where I made my, my, I made my way. I started in operations, headed into the sales and now I'm back in, in operations, so. Followed a similar, similar path. So talk to me about some of the challenges that you've had throughout your career, whether it's on the brokerage sides around the content and the freight coaching side of things.
[00:05:40] Speaker C: I think the biggest challenge is always me. My, my mindset, like my mentality on stuff. It's, you know, I think that it's so easy, consumed with the, you know, because it's hard building a business, building a book of business. It's really hard. And then you start to question, you know, is it you? You know, like, do I just suck? And I think those were probably some of the biggest challenges that I've had to overcome in that is realizing like, these things take time, right. Like to get customers to build a business and then on top of it to keep customers. It takes a lot longer than anybody wants. And I think in, you know, in today's day and age, it's just instant, instant gratification. You want food, you can get it in 15 minutes. You know, you have to fight for anything really anymore. So it, it kind of changes your perspective. So I think that's kind of like been the biggest challenge that I faced and you know, and then, you know, a close second is, is kind of when you at least in your mind do everything right and still lose a customer. Yeah, I think that's probably been the. One of the more challenging things this is. It's like, hey, yesterday you told me how great I was and then today, you know, it's not you, it's me. Like what is.
[00:06:54] Speaker A: Yeah, we're no longer in business together.
[00:06:56] Speaker C: Yeah, that's probably been some of the other challenging times.
[00:06:59] Speaker A: Yeah, I've certainly run into a few roadblocks too of not taking that. You Know, there's. I think whatever the line is, is, like, you're only as good as your last order moved or load moved. Right? Like, that's really. That can be a tough mentality to get over.
Is that. Man, oh, man, I'm looking at this board. We've been working together for six months. We've moved 248 shipments together, and 247 of them went really, really well. And now you are jumping down my throat because I missed a delivery by two hours or something like that on the. On the last shipment. I get it. I understand. Like, that's what we're supposed to deliver for. For our customers. But sometimes those conversations are really, really hard to.
To get over and move forward with.
[00:07:43] Speaker C: Yeah, no, they. They really are. Right. And I think, like, but it's also one of those situations where it does give you an opportunity to. To look back and be like, all right, what wasn't I doing at that time? Right. Like, because again, we. We only perceive it through our perspective.
[00:08:00] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:08:01] Speaker C: We don't actually stop to think, like, all right, was there something I did wrong that maybe my customer had asked about a few times? But I just kind of looked over it, and I think that that's how you need to kind of face a lot of these situations. Right. Like, is, like, what. What can you learn from that? Like, you know, we were saying before we kind of started was, is. You know, I learned. I learned a lot of what not to do. And I think that once you can actually go back and look through that and be like, all right, this is an opportunity, like, failure. You know, maybe this is because I'm almost 40 now, where I'm like, all right, failure is an opportunity to learn. It's an opportunity for me to get better. It's not necessarily a negative. It sucks in the moment, but, like, after the storm kind of passes and you can, you know, with a clear head, stop and think, like, all right, how can I approach this differently next time? Like, what actually happened? I think that it's only going to prepare you to become better in the long run.
[00:08:54] Speaker B: And I think that that is great. And how do you. When you're delivering your training, how do you get across what you've learned not to do in them? And how is that, I guess, accepted,
[00:09:05] Speaker C: at least for my. Like, you could tell me, Teddy, that the stove is hot like, a hundred times, but I'm still gonna go touch it.
[00:09:11] Speaker B: Oh, yeah.
[00:09:12] Speaker C: I think that it's. It's kind of the same thing where I think the best Experience or like the best learning moments are when people actually experience it and then they're like, oh, wait, okay, you weren't just lying, you know, like.
And I think that sometimes you need to let people go through those situations because it's easy for us to, you know, on this podcast or, you know, if we're ever like talking, you know, to a group of people, it's easy to sit up there and say the right thing to do and how, like, what to avoid. But when you're, the human emotions are involved in it, you know, and the ego starts to come into play in a lot of these situations, sometimes you need to go through that stuff to actually understand what you're being taught.
[00:09:59] Speaker B: That's, that's so true. And I see it internally, but I also do see that with customers we do have to act as that person that can be there with them to say, now we know, let's change the plan going forward. That is definitely human nature. It's not just logistics, for sure.
[00:10:16] Speaker C: Yeah. I also just think it's just, you know, you know, maturing a little bit in life because, you know, I think we were all in, you know, our late teens and early twenties at some point and we all thought we had it all figured out. And some people learn a lot earlier than others, you know, that you don't have it all figured out. And maybe sometimes these individuals who are giving you advice are trying to save you a little bit of headache with it. But you know, at least with me, I'm just that stubborn that I gotta actually get punched in the face myself before I'll realize I probably shouldn't do that.
[00:10:48] Speaker B: It's important to get humbled on a, at least a weekly basis.
[00:10:52] Speaker C: Yeah, I would agree with that.
[00:10:54] Speaker A: We talked a little about. You're currently running a brokerage, you have a brokerage arm of it. So technically we're competitors. Right. But it sounds like we share similar values. So some of our values are partnership, communication, honesty and experience is certainly going to fall in line with yours. But so we like to talk about educating our customers and equipping them with the best practices. You know, basically explaining the why around what we do on a day to day basis. Tell us some about the, some of the, your values. You talked about what not to do, what are the things that you're trying to emphasize people to do.
[00:11:31] Speaker C: Think that when I'm out there talking to people, I want to actually try and get a better understanding their operations and the why behind it. Right. I think when I'm going in And I'm prospecting shippers.
Like, I never talk about price. I never asked to be, you know, can I quote on your freight or, you know, or add me to. I don't ask about any of that stuff because I feel like the real efficiencies is kind of uncovering their operational inefficiencies. Right. And that might come into the play of, hey, we're shipping out two weekly or you know, two monthly partials that are landing in the exact same area, but they could be loaded on a full truck. And nobody's ever brought it to their attention because the broker makes way more money partially than they would by running it as a 1 pick 2 drop, dedicated load and then, you know, bringing alternative methods to it. Right. Like, because we do a lot of open deck freight and the amount of people who aren't aware of like what a Conestoga is, is kind of, you know, again, you'd be surprised. Right. And again, it's like most people, most sales reps, not everybody look at it as how can you as the individual, make the most money in that transaction? And again, I'm a capitalist. No harm, no foul. But that's just not the way that I do business. Right. Like, I want to create a partnership out there and I've had enough customers in my life tell me like, hey, we're not a transportation company, we're a manufacturer. Right. So like contrary to what you might think, we don't know everything about shipping. That's why we hired you. And when you're going in there, I, I really want to assess kind of where things are and is it going to be a fit for me? Right. Like Andrew said something yesterday on my show that, I mean, it really resonated with me a lot. Is this customer actually a fit for your business?
Because they have a lot of volume or a lot of opportunities doesn't mean that it's good for you. And I think that that's something that a lot of people need to really think about as you're going in there and prospecting some of the people that you are because is it a fit for you right now or is this something that you probably outside of your capabilities.
[00:13:35] Speaker A: Yeah. And absolutely. Even peeling the layers back within those customers. Right. Maybe they, maybe you don't want their materials, but you want their finished product. Or for us, Right. We specialize in Walmart and Costco freight. So that, that's great. Those are heavy fines and, and with mabd adherence expectations. So that's where we can thrive. But you know, Some of the other retailers that they deliver into, maybe that those don't make as much sense for us. So trying to, you know, fit put that square peg into the square hole, if you will.
[00:14:07] Speaker C: Yeah, no, I, I agree with that. And I think, you know, that another lesson to kind of learn on some of these things is, is, you know, not all business is going to be good business. And you know, you need to understand that as you're going out there. And you know, because I think a lot of times, you know, also is, is like, hey, you know, you put your prospects in a pedestal, right? Because again, they're giving you a little bit of attention. It's lonely out there when, you know, with all the rejection, this is just going to be the perfect customer ever.
And I think that if you can kind of keep an open mind as you're going in there, like, all right, I'm here to find, is this going to work out for me and my business? I think it helps with a lot of the, you know, the anxiety of trying to cold call somebody or, you know, do a cold site visit.
[00:14:53] Speaker A: That's awesome. I love everything you just said.
[00:14:56] Speaker B: I do too. And I think that this industry is so fast paced and it moves so quickly and it really does create a lot of learning opportunities. And that's what's one of the most beautiful things about this industry is you can take everything that you've learned or learned not to do and be able to have different service offerings based off of that, regardless of who the customer is. Like you said, it may not be an actual, like, it may not be like a freight or customer. It may be manufacturing. Those little nuances and differences make a huge impact in what they're learning or how they're operating.
[00:15:30] Speaker C: Yeah, I, I, I think that, you know, what you were saying here a little bit ago as well, about, you know, us being competitors and everything else, I'm like, I think we can all agree on, you know, when it comes to best practices and everything else, we, we all know that there's a stigma out there that freight brokers are bad, right? Like shippers share that carrier share that. If we put more of the best practices out there, if, you know, the zip lines of the, of the world and myself and other freight brokers out there, if we service our customers and carriers at such a high level, maybe we can start changing that perspective out there. Because, like, this industry is massive, right? Like, there's a, like there's so much opportunity that's out there that nobody needs to undercut anybody. Else or cut anybody else down. But if you highlight the right things that are out there, I think everybody gets elevated. And then I think we kind of make it so blatantly obvious that these other people are not good, that it makes it a lot more. I don't want to call it easier for the people who are doing it the right things, but it makes it so much more blatantly obvious, like, hey, these guys are quality. There's none of that other smokescreen that are out there then that people can kind of hide behind.
[00:16:38] Speaker B: Beautifully said.
[00:16:40] Speaker A: Yeah, that's a great, That's a really, really good mentality to have. And I agree with you. I think we, I would go. My go to line would be we're not a freight broker, we're a logistics company that, that would land with some people.
[00:16:51] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:16:51] Speaker A: Our titles used to be logistics sales consultants.
So we know, we were trying to separate ourselves from that, you know, quote unquote grimy broker mentality or reputation like you say. But yeah, it's tough out there, right. When some of the big boys are Fortune 500 or even bigger companies and they are definitely focused on the bottom line only and they develop a reputation very, very quickly because they're prioritizing profit over, over everything else.
Which again, like you said, you're a capitalist. It makes sense. We're, we're in the business to, to make money. I like, I get it, I want to have a job tomorrow and in the future. So that's part of it. But I think you can get it, get there a different way than just saying, you know, bottom line over everything else.
[00:17:37] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:38] Speaker C: And I understand that. Right. Like everybody's in business to make money ultimately. Right. But I don't want to do it at the expense of another person. You know, like, I think that there's a way of doing it to where it is. There is a win, win, win that comes out there where we win as the broker, the customer wins, but then most importantly, the carrier wins as well.
[00:17:56] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:17:56] Speaker C: You know, like, because like, ultimately they're the ones who are out there braving the elements and doing the work. Right. Like, no matter what. I'm not saying brokers are irrelevant or anything like that, but like, let's be real. I'm in an air conditioned office. Yeah. All day long. I'm not out there strapping down a truck, you know, a trailer. I'm not jumping in and out of the cab of my truck. I'm not dealing with traffic and stuff like that all day long.
[00:18:18] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:18:18] Speaker C: To put up with that they deserve to make money. And the fact that there's people out there who just. Who are only concerned about their own bottom line. I also think that they're the ones who kind of end up being the flash in the pan where, you know, they might be good for a little bit, but that's not a good business model long term. You know, like, I believe in responsible capitalism, you know, where it's like, I can make money, everybody can make money, but my customers are overly satisfied with me, my carriers are satisfied with me. Because ultimately I want to be a broker of choice to everybody. I want to be a broker of choice to carriers, and I want to be a broker of choice to customers.
[00:18:51] Speaker A: I love it. Yeah, it's a great reminder. Every time I go to a shipper or receiver or even, you know, stop at the highway, at a truck stop, it's a. It's a great reminder to appreciate what you have and come into the same office every day and running everything through a computer.
[00:19:06] Speaker B: That partnership on both sides is so important. I'm so glad that you mentioned that. And I feel like I've always thought of myself as a customer service rep who happened to know a couple things about logistics rather than a broker, because, you know, when someone calls, they need directions. When some customer calls and asks a question, it's really about answering it. And like you said, getting to know the root of it, not just throwing details out there to try to get the next load or gain more money or freight or something.
And the market is one of those things that I feel like everyone constantly has questions about. You could talk about this for days and still not have it solved.
[00:19:45] Speaker C: No, I. I agree. And, you know, about being, you know, kind of to cover what you're talking about, about the customer service aspect of things, like, you got to service the drivers as well here. You know, like it. Like why. I don't know why some individuals can't wrap their head around the fact that the driver's preparedness and for the shipment is a direct reflection of your ability to do your job to your customers. So if you're like, withholding information, if you're not helping them out in that situation that has such a negative effect on your business from your customer's perspective, then, you know, not. Not to even mention that you're building up a resistance of drivers that won't haul freight for you, you know, but, like, I'm just like, I want my drivers to be as successful as possible. And, you know, one of the things that we do right now and we're going to always do this, no matter how big my company gets, is doing site visits, going and visiting our shippers, our receivers, finding this out. Because how many times have you guys been to a customer's facility and you're like, dang, the driver actually needs to go to the third entrance here. Yeah, they would have went to the front one. They could have got stuck and everything else. And then they're burning clock time. Then they're frustrated, the customer's mad. And all it took was about 10 seconds of going out there, walking around and being like, all right, Mr. And Mrs. Driver, go to the third entrance, check into Dock Door 17. That's where everything is. Be aware you're gonna have a blind back in or something like that. Yeah, you can give all that information out and you should be doing that.
[00:21:08] Speaker A: Those specifics go a long way. You're absolutely right. Right. And, and it's very, the on site visits is, is certainly going above and beyond. That's great. You know, I don't want to say pestering a shipper or, or someone, or picking up the phone and talking to someone at the shipper. Get, you know where exactly check in. Oh, yo, check in at the, the check in door. Like, well, come on now. I know it's going to make your life easier. Where is the check in door? Is it between door 45 and door 48? All right, now we're getting a little more specifics. Like you said, go on off of the Smith Road exit instead of the Sullivan Road exit. Like, even though the address is Sullivan Road, like, all those little things, those little nuances go a long way to drive some efficiency. That's awesome.
[00:21:52] Speaker B: I think so too. With that, those relationships not only make your day a little bit more fun, being able to call and have an actual conversation, but then you're, you're giving information and you're getting information.
Warehouses, drivers, all of these different elements within your network that you're creating help give details. Like Jesse said, we are, we specialize in cpg. A lot of our drivers give us information about the retailers and about what they're seeing in the marketplace. And that helps us continue to communicate. Which I want to ask you, Chris, what do you see in the biggest trends in the market? How do you coach people about this with everyone saying, I see it's going to change soon? When's the next flip? What is your messaging around that?
[00:22:34] Speaker C: Messaging is. The overall freight market is irrelevant to 99 of the providers that are in this market. Right. Because I don't know, one person, one business that is in this industry, or any industry right now for that matter, that can look back and be like, yeah, we're good, we don't need to develop any more customers. All of our customers are perfectly satisfied with us. And you know, I think that your approach right now more than ever is, you know, you got to focus on the quality of everything because like, what if it doesn't change, right? Like there's so much talk of when it's going to change, what if it doesn't? Then what are you going to do, you know, And I think that so many people, and again, like, it's very indicative of the society that we live in now of what's the easiest route. Why isn't it easy yet? Why isn't it easy instead of what can I do to get better in the current setting right now? Because that's where your mentality should be. Because there is a lot riding on our economy improving and there is no clear signs out there right now that it's going to change. And you know, furthermore, yes, there's an election here in a couple of months, but what if it doesn't change anything? Then what are you going to do? Are you going to sit around in another 12 months to be like, what's it going to change? When's it going to make it easy? And then you're going to look back and have wasted a year as opposed to what can I do today to move the bottom line of my business?
So that's the way that I'm approaching it. Because, you know, furthermore, if you can operate and show growth in a down market and you can apply those exact same strategies and tactics in an up market, you're going to quadruple or 10x in size during that time. So that's what you should be working on right now to prepare is am I as good as I think I am in my head? Is there something else I should be doing right now? Again, I'm a big believer in the basics and the fundamentals of this industry. The blocking and tackling, you know, like cold calling, site visits, stuff like that. Everybody wants to automate everything. I'm not doing that at all. And I, I looked at it as I took the bait on the email only bug for 15 months and we got nowhere. We spun our wheels from a business development standpoint, but we've only exclusively been cold calling and doing site visits now for like the last four months. And we have had a windfall of conversations, opportunities, getting starting, quoting with, you know, New customers and having actual real conversations that weren't there via email. So there's a lot of noise out there, Teddy, right now about what could happen, what couldn't happen. But the reality is is I need revenue in my business.
I need to fight for that and I need to now more than ever prove my quality over everybody else because it is completely oversaturated. As it is in every industry, though, this isn't just trucking, it is very oversaturated. There is a ton of competition out there and only the quality will survive this stuff.
[00:25:29] Speaker B: I love that message.
[00:25:30] Speaker A: I'm ready to run through a wall, Chris. I'm ready to run through a wall. That was awesome. Gosh. Dial for diesel, baby. Pick up the phone, Teddy. Make someone's day today.
God, I love it. Chris, where can we find you? Where can our listeners find you? Where do they, where can they get a hold of you? Plug. Plug all of your businesses?
[00:25:51] Speaker C: Yeah, you could. I mean, honestly, the best way to do it is, is you can just look up the Freight Coach on any social media platform. My podcast is out there on itunes and Spotify. Or you can just email me direct, Chris, at the Freightcoach.com and I'm here to help in any way I can. Right. If I can't do something, if you have a question about something I can't specifically answer, I'm very fortunate to have a very vast network of individuals that I can put people in contact with to help them out in their businesses.
[00:26:17] Speaker A: So good. Thank you so much for joining us today.
For all of our listeners out there, leave us a five star review on Spotify or Apple. You can call us888go zipline. Www.ziplinelogistics.com Chris, thank you again so much. We hope to talk to you soon. Any, any final parting words, I think.
[00:26:38] Speaker C: Well, for starters, Jesse, Teddy, thank you guys so much. And the entire zipline organization, you guys are awesome. Emily was great to work with, having Andrew on. I think it's, it's a very clear top down culture that you guys run there about running a quality organization. So I just want to put that out there. I talk to a lot of people. I try and get a lot of stuff dialed in from the media side of things. You guys have been completely seamless to work with. So I just think if that's, if that's how you guys work on this diagram, I could only imagine how much you guys dominate on the trade.
[00:27:09] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:27:10] Speaker A: We appreciate it. Yeah, we feel the same way. That's awesome. All right, folks, we'll see you next time on the Zipline Logistics podcast. Thank you, Chris.
[00:27:18] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:27:19] Speaker A: Thank you, Teddy.
